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Post by Alatariel on Jun 16, 2024 11:33:41 GMT -6
Avignon, Year of our Lord, 1375
Ilrapo Nestorus of Venice and Dante Caligari of Genoa entered the upstairs room of the Rapier’s Wit, past the two guards.
The aroma’s of roast pig, chicken, a spicy stew, and warm cinnamon mead filled their senses. Giovani Illustris was being fed grapes by two serving wenches, next to the fireplace.
“Ladies, leave us but return to entertain these gentlemen, after I’ve left.”
They smiled, one chose Ilrapo, the other Dante. Each lady ran a finger across their condottiere’s lips, as they left. Ilrapo and Dante’s heads turned to watch them saunter out the door.
“Put those rain sodden cloaks on a peg, get some food and drink, and sit by the fire. Glad that you’re interested in what I have to say.” He said in Latin.
“When the great Signore Giovani Acuto wishes to speak to you, only a fool would ignore such an invitation.” said Dante.
“My reputation precedes me. Still want the unending wars between Italy’s plethora of republics, to end?”
Ilrapo said, “To waste money with no profit or enjoyment obtained doesn’t follow logic or the laws of nature.”
“Time is short, agree with what I say. Then you’ll meet my employer.”
Both men smiled.
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Post by HDSimplicityy on Jun 18, 2024 20:29:55 GMT -6
I read this on my phone during lunch break. Wanted to edit it, but I wanted more time to consider my thoughts. Soooo...
This is a good start. A pretty good one, yeah. This can read a bit better by starting with that first line of dialogue. The first line of narration reads like a second section of Chapter 1, after the hook's been established.
So: " “Ladies, leave us. But return to entertain these gentlemen after I’ve left.”
Ilrapo Nestorus of Venice and Dante Caligari of Genoa had entered the upstairs room of the Rapier’s Wit, past the two guards.
The aromas (not aroma's) of roast pig, chicken, a spicy stew, and warm cinnamon mead filled their senses. Giovani Illustris was being fed grapes by two serving wenches, next to the fireplace. "
That little change alone makes me want to know MORE what is going to be said.
Further thoughts:
"Still want the unending wars between Italy’s plethora of republics, to end?”" is a little wordy. Removing plethora makes the syllables to read less like word salad.
I like the "To waste money" and "Meet my employer" lines. It tells me this character has absolute power in decision making, or where it comes from.
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Post by havekrillwhaletravel on Jun 21, 2024 0:28:01 GMT -6
The main mystery here is Giovani's (or I'm guessing his employer's) plan. But what interests me more is how the hook is mum about the motivation of all the characters.
I'm assuming that Venice and Genoa are at war. Have things gotten so bad that both sides are willing to come to the table, or are Dante and Ilrapo here independently for personal gain? What does Giovani have to gain from brokering this prace? I'm assuming he isn't doing this out of the goodness of his heart. The opaque motivations of the players on the board make the premise much more interesting.
There are places where I think could use a bit more clarity:
I got what he's saying, but I think it's unnecessarily clunky. There's three different instructions here about leaving/returning. I'd suggest rephrasing the sentence or reducing the number of instructions. Maybe something like: "Ladies, leave us. You'll have plenty of time to entertain these gentlemen later."
A minor bit, but I think you could remove "heads" here.
Again, I feel there's too much going on in the first sentence. This could be broken down into smaller sentences, like maybe: "Put those cloaks on a peg. You're soaking wet! Get some food and drink. Come! Sit by the fire."
Giovani doesn't appear in the previous two sentences, so I think stating "Giovani said" instead of "He said" adds a bit of clarity.
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Post by ScintillaMyntan on Jun 23, 2024 13:09:29 GMT -6
This took a little web searching to understand. I learned that Giovanni Acuto — spelled with a double N, so I guess that's an inconsistency — was a mercenary leader. Sounds like an interesting character to write about. I'm still not particularly sure what's happening in this story, which may be from my lack of background knowledge. There are wars among the republics; does that mean Venice and Genoa are at war, and these two guests are actually at war with each other due to Giovani's funding them? He's telling them to comply with his orders to go to war, and he'll help them work out an end to the war by talking to his employer, or something?
The scene is set very nicely. The sensory details make it vivid and easy to imagine. The formal dialogue and details of the servants suggest luxury. Giovani is set up to sound shady, with his overly opulent lifestyle and his demand that they agree with what he says. I can tell there's plenty of conflict and intrigue to follow this intro.
It's a bit light on prompt. The only reference to "out of time" seems to be Giovani saying, "Time is short," without, as far as I can tell, an indication of how that's important or relevant to the plot.
Some technical errors:
Plural, not possessive
"They smiled" should be its own sentence.
Doesn't need the comma
Dialogue tags are part of the same sentence as the quote, so comma instead of period. However, you might not need to put it as a tag, and just have "Giovani spoke in Latin" as a separate sentence after the quote.
Also comma instead of period here.
Doesn't need this comma. Think of it as a simpler sentence: "Still want the wars to end?" You wouldn't put a comma there, would you? So when instead of "wars" you have a longer phrase, you still don't need a comma.
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Post by Caulder Melhaire on Jun 26, 2024 18:10:19 GMT -6
SPaG/Writing notes:
The aroma’s aromas of roast pig
“Ladies, leave us but return to entertain these gentlemen, after I’ve left.” This reads a bit long, maybe try splitting it: “Ladies, leave us. You may return to entertain these gentlemen after I’ve left.”
Same with this one: "They smiled, one chose Ilrapo, the other Dante." "They smiled. One chose Ilrapo, the other, Dante."
It was contextually visible when I read this, but with 3 "He's" in the room, it would be good to mention that Giovani is the one speaking, especially as the narrative's focus recently shifted from Giovani to our dynamic duo.
No comma there at the end of 'republics.'
Artistic notes:
Quick question, is it Giovani Illustris or Acuto? I'm assuming from some quick searching that Illustris is an honorific of sorts. If so, it maaaay be more appropriate to address him with that in the dialogue rather than in the narration?
I love the way this scene is set, because there's not a deluge of details, but just pleasantly enough that I can quite vividly imagine the room they stand in. It's very well done. I also find it interesting that Giovani has an employer, yet it seems he is the one with a reputation for the sort of ability that could end a war. It's a neat bit of exposition to cement his status for the coming tale. And it also adds some mystery around the employer, because I have to wonder which way they're going to try and end these wars.
Main questions I have:
- So this Giovani dude has a reputation, but someone hired him. What on earth could that person be planning?
- What role do Dante and Ilrapo play in this tale?
Prompt notes:
So the prompt is there at the end, but I think it needs more setup. “Time is short, agree with what I say. Then you’ll meet my employer.” We can guess that they're almost out of time to meet this employer, but given the more casual tone of the story thus far, it doesn't really impact me as much as it could.
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Post by FoxxGlove on Jun 28, 2024 11:05:46 GMT -6
Quite a few sprinkling of errors here. I won't go over them all but, for example: "aromas" instead of "aroma's" and a rather a liberal over-use of commas where not needed. That having been said, the description of the Rapier's Wit (which I assume to be some type of inn or tavern) was very well constructed and nicely atmospheric.
The fulfillment of the prompt is a little vague. I didn't get the sense of a time issue until the mention that: "Time is short."
For me, the jury is still out on whether this is an effective hook or not. Personally, I don't think I was sufficiently intrigued by the introduction to follow the tale much further; however, I can see the potential.
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Post by Alatariel on Jun 28, 2024 17:35:42 GMT -6
I'm definitely left wondering what this meeting is about and how it impacts our two characters. I'm not sure who is the focus of the story or where the narrative voice is coming from- Ilrapo or Dante? Who is telling the story? It seems to be from both of their perspective simultaneously. There isn't an internal commentary or personal thoughts on the situation or setting. I'd like to get more personal so that I feel compelled to move forward. For me, it's a character to snags my interests and it's because of them I choose to continue onward with a story.
Besides that, I'm curious enough to turn the page and see what happens next! I'm not sure how they are running out of time, so perhaps some internal thought about that could help increase the urgency and tension of the meeting.
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Post by pelwrath on Jul 2, 2024 10:10:58 GMT -6
Thank you all for such detailed comments. In this I didn’t want any personal aspects, just the mystery of what’s going on? Who’s behind it and why Ilrapo and Dante.
I that I appear to have been successful, alas technical writing is still an expectation, and there I failed.
In 1375 the Pope is in Avignon not Rome. Genoa and Venice are embroiled in a small little affair and the other republics (Milan, Florence, in the north and The Kingdom of Naples in the south) are the main played along with the Papal States which divide them.
The Ottomans are a problem in the east and there are dynastic issued in Germany, Austria, Hungary, and Poland.
Acuto, acting on some information, presented an idea to the Pope, who gave his blessing for him to make inquiries.
Working on my initial revisions.
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Post by pelwrath on Jul 3, 2024 20:14:54 GMT -6
My first revision based on the comments and suggestions.
Avignon, Year of our Lord, 1375
The aromas of roast pig, chicken, a spicy stew, and warm cinnamon mead filled their senses. Giovanni Acuto, the host, was being fed grapes by two serving wenches, next to the fireplace, when Ilrapo Nestorus of Venice and Dante Caligari of Genoa entered the upstairs room of the Rapier’s Wit. The guards closing the door behind them.
He gestured to the ladies. “Leave us! Return and entertain these gentlemen, after I leave.”
They each ran a finger across the condottiere’s lips, who turned to watch them saunter out the door.
“Put those rain sodden cloaks on a peg. Fill your plate and mug, then sit here by me. You don’t have much time to decide.” Acuto said in Latin.
“When the Illustris, Signore Giovani Acuto wishes to speak to you, only a fool would ignore such an invitation.” said Dante.
“My reputation always precedes me. Aren’t you both tired of the costly and bloody wars between Italy’s republics?”
Ilrapo said, “Wasting money with no profit or enjoyment obtained doesn’t follow logic or the laws of nature.”
“Agree to what I ask, before I leave, and more than the ladies could be yours. You’ll meet my employer and learn something.”
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Post by ScintillaMyntan on Jul 4, 2024 9:46:22 GMT -6
I would put the first paragraph like this:
Here's my reasoning:
We don't know who "their" is yet. Yes, probably everyone in the scene can smell this stuff. But it matters because we don't know yet whose head we're seeing the story from. I think you want the reader to identify with Ilrapo and Dante, while Giovanni is mysterious. I added "the guests' senses" to show that we're supposed to identify with the guests. I started the story with them to show that I as the reader am not supposed to really know what's going on in the Rapier's Wit until the guests get there. It also helps show that the room Giovanni is in is the Rapier's Wit, rather than he being somewhere with a fireplace while elsewhere, the other two guys go into a place called the Rapier's Wit.
This is spelling it out a bit much. I can tell he's the host if he has guests and seems to live there.
Not a complete sentence. It should be stuck on the previous sentence with a comma, but since the previous sentence is already pretty long, I just changed "closing" to "closed" and made it its own sentence.
Comma instead of period because the dialogue tag is the same sentence as the quote. But like I said, you could also just not have a dialogue tag, and have a separate sentence to show that Acuto is speaking Latin. So:
Commas set off a piece of information that explains the phrase you're using, that isn't crucial to the sentence structure. You need a comma after "Signore Giovanni Acuto" because his name is an extra phrase that explains "Illustris." And again, comma before the dialogue tag, not period.
Doesn't need the comma
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Post by pelwrath on Jul 4, 2024 15:24:02 GMT -6
Thank you Scintilla foryour time and suggestions.
One of the comma rules I had heard of was, if you take a breath, a comma goes there. I'll have to add to that about being part of the same sentance.
I’ll play around with that paragraph.
Maybe LF contests aren’t for me. My lack of consistent and almost perfect S.P., and G is a huge pothole that my submissions always fall into. The deadline also makes me rush to decide on a story.
Out there I’m a good writer, in here not so good. If that's unerstandable.
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Post by pelwrath on Jul 5, 2024 18:42:34 GMT -6
Avignon, Year of our Lord, 1375 v2
When Ilrapo Nestorus of Venice and Dante Caligari of Genoa entered the upstairs room of the Rapier’s Wit, the guards closed the door behind them. Giovanni Acuto was being fed grapes next to the fireplace, by two serving wenches. The aromas of roast pig, chicken, a spicy stew, and warm cinnamon mead filled their senses.
He gestured to the ladies. “Leave us! Return and entertain these gentlemen, after I leave.”
They smiled enticingly, winked, and ran a finger across the condottiere’s lips, who turned to watch them saunter out the door.
“Put those rain sodden cloaks on a peg. Fill your plate and mug and sit here by me. You have a quarter of a candle to decide,” Acuto said in Latin.
“When the Illustris, Signore Giovani Acuto wishes to speak to you, only a fool would ignore such an invitation,” said Dante.
“Ones reputation always precedes them. Aren’t you tired of the costly and bloody wars between Italy’s republics?”
Ilrapo said, “Wasting money with no profit or enjoyment obtained doesn’t follow logic or the laws of nature.”
“Agree to what I ask, and more than the ladies could be yours. You’ll meet my employer and make a fortune.”
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Post by ScintillaMyntan on Jul 6, 2024 14:47:06 GMT -6
Avignon, Year of our Lord, 1375 v2 A good improvement, in my opinion.
Do remember the comma for "said Dante."
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Post by pelwrath on Jul 6, 2024 17:11:35 GMT -6
Scintilla,
Thank you collectively for your time, suggestions, and kind words.
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You add them to your profile as you do them around the forum.
